Posted By: gregi'll keep the respirator close by, i think you'll be needing it :sad:yeah, discouraging, to say the least. I've had a hidden forum active now for several years. There aren't very many members registered there, but these are people I used to know from a couple of MLM bix-opps we were all involved with years ago. We all remained friends and I let that forum continue for them. I make an effort to communicate with them at least once a week...despite how busy I may be, or whatever personal stuff is going on in my life. Perhaps, it's time to remind admin, that it is the members that make a community great, and if admin chooses to neglect the members, then the members will move on to other things, and will not be as loyal as they could be. I'm sorry if that statement sounds rather harsh, but that is how I feel. Mods, please do not spank me for this! :wink:
Open Designs Forum » Site Specific
Design Contest - Ideas Needed
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Posted 3 years ago #
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Posted By: arwen54Mods, please do not spank me for this!
Now why would I (as a mod) do that? Especially when I agree 100%. Action needs to be taken pretty quickly on giving something back to the members. Especially after the last contest fiasco. There were several ideas given on how to handle that & it was decided by the admins to just let it slide by & say it's not our problem. It was in the rules form the contest holder that he could bow out, but it left a pretty big mark on OD. That mark still lingers. Time to give back to the OD members guys. It's been 1 1/2 months since this topic was started....lets not let it slide by again.Posted 3 years ago # -
i agree as well karen but i'm tired of asking to be honest...thats why i dont bother coming around here much anymore. i find the lack of communication frustrating and i dont want to beat the admins up verbally about it so i stay away. i used to come here a few times a day but now i might visit once a week. the OR contest was a disaster and it still hasn't been made 'right' even though i think the majority of the members here want the money given back in a contest. i mean why the hell are we mods anyways? to correct spelling mistakes in the forums? i personally did it because i wanted to keep an eye on the site so the same thing didn't happen all over again that happened at OSWD and then openwebdesign...well, it doesn't look good and we have zero control here. i'm not accusing anyone of hijacking the site yet but as i have said many times there needs to be changes in the power structure (not necessarily who's in charge). as far as i know the screenshots of income still haven't been made available to the mods and i've asked several times. there's an old thread around here about that but i'm not looking for it. yes, i'm in a bad mood and just happened to drop by :devil:Posted 3 years ago #
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I just emailed both Joe and Christopher, the other 2 admins. If I don't get a reply within a day or two (allowing for time zone differences), I'll post again. Basically I have the Kontera money on hold... I don't have access to the Google adsense money, so I can't do anything with that. If needed, I can use the Kontera money for some sort of a mini contest prize... it's not a lot but better then nothing. More to come once I get a reply from Joe and/ or Christopher.Posted 3 years ago #
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We've all said it before... there's only one thing worse than no promises... and that's a broken promise. To Sean and all the other admins, PLEASE don't make a promise/suggestion/offer without being able to do it, or if you can't at least have the courtesy to pop by and explain why you can't do it. In any case I think it is time for OD to give a big hearty thankyou to those who made this site, put their names on the front page in their honour and move on by holding an election for a new panel of admins, and maybe with a constitution of sorts. I think it's time for the admins to recognize when it's time to let go and for the good of the community leave it to others who can keep it growing. Should this be a new thread? PetePosted 3 years ago #
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@Pete: When I said "If needed, I can use the Kontera money for some sort of a mini contest prize... it's not a lot but better then nothing", that is something I do have control over and can do. I am not the sort of person/admin to make promises and not follow through. I do what I can, when I can but with this site, there are other admins involved and other members as well. It's not so simple cut and dry like you suggest. Your statement "I think it's time for the admins to recognize when it's time to let go and for the good of the community leave it to others who can keep it growing" sort of rubbed me the wrong way, especially after my history and contributions to the open source community since early 2000. I've been a part of this community since 2002, on OSWD, then OWD then being a founding member of OD. Not sure if you remember but 6 months before OD started, I was pretty much the only person keeping OWD alive (being an admin) with updates of designs and trying to communicate with the members about the site status in the forums as well as direct communication with Aaron (original owner of OWD) and Shay the guy who purchased the site. If I was to let something go or wasn't able to keep things going, I wouldn't be there then or here today. I've actually considered stepping down from being an admin here multiple times and for good reason. The majority of people only see the surface stuff and think it's just easy to run a site like this, build things, keep the peace, etc... but it's not. Blood, sweat and tears go into it and it's definitely not something for the faint at heart. I got a reply from Joe... and I just replied to him... more to come...Posted 3 years ago #
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Sean, your post needs some answering...
When I said "If needed, I can use the Kontera money for some sort of a mini contest prize... it's not a lot but better then nothing", that is something I do have control over and can do.
I didn't think I mentioned anything about prize money?I am not the sort of person/admin to make promises and not follow through.
Maybe that one is best left between me and you and you know what.I do what I can, when I can but with this site, there are other admins involved and other members as well. It's not so simple cut and dry like you suggest.
You didn't address my "... at least have the courtesy to pop by and explain why you can't do it" part. I just think it's out of line for Chris to have started this thread and then leave it unanswered. Surely you agree it would have been better off not even started rather than build up hopes. To me that's pretty simple. The other example was many of us asking for extra features (most popular template/voting etc.) to be implemented and nothing happens until there's a mini uprising in this forum. Members were falling over themselves to help and they were more or less totally ignored. As well we still aren't getting regular transparent reports on our ad revenue s. Like we all want!Your statement "I think it's time for the admins to recognize when it's time to let go and for the good of the community leave it to others who can keep it growing" sort of rubbed me the wrong way, especially after my history and contributions to the open source community since early 2000.
Of course it rubbed you the wrong way Sean. I think you see this site as your site rather than the community's. We can only blow the wind up you so much and say thanks for your help, but it doesn't take away from the fact that this site would do well with new blood with new ideas and new motivation. That in no way undermines what you have done... And if you think it does then i'm afraid that's one for you to sort out in your own mind. If you're going to rationalize the reason why you should stay as to the past rather than the future then you'll always justify not allowing new admins.I've been a part of this community since 2002, on OSWD, then OWD then being a founding member of OD.
So what? I was a Ambulance Paramedic for many years and saved many lives, I now care for severely disabled people and I volunteer my time for many other causes... but the world owes me nothing nor do I expect or want anything in return. You volunteered and as far as I know you didn't place a condition on it that you decide what happens on this site's future.Not sure if you remember but 6 months before OD started, I was pretty much the only person keeping OWD alive (being an admin) with updates of designs and trying to communicate with the members about the site status in the forums as well as direct communication with Aaron (original owner of OWD) and Shay the guy who purchased the site.
Sorry Sean but you're losing track of what the members are trying say to you if you keep on falling back to the old "but look what i done". You'll find we'll get sick and tired of saying "thanks so much". Let's move on.If I was to let something go or wasn't able to keep things going, I wouldn't be there then or here today.
It's not about just keeping things going, it's about moving forward with the members.I've actually considered stepping down from being an admin here multiple times and for good reason. The majority of people only see the surface stuff and think it's just easy to run a site like this, build things, keep the peace, etc... but it's not. Blood, sweat and tears go into it and it's definitely not something for the faint at heart.
I know you have thought about it, you've actually said it in this forum before. Believe or not the job of the admin is to take the burden of the other stuff and leave the surface stuff to the members, it's what you volunteered for. But there are others out there also able to do it and as a community we should be able to decide on who we want to do it. Hell, they may be better at it than you Sean? Yes I know blood, sweat and tears go into it... yadda yadda, and that's it's not for the faint hearted... yadda, yadda. Technically it would beat me hands down, emotionally/mentally it wouldn't compare to resuscitating a young child who's just been hit by a car. my point being you have my thanks(and always will) but you don't have my pity. In other words, if the members think they would like others to run this show, why would you want to stop that from happening... after all it's about the site not you. Cheers PetePosted 3 years ago # -
Sean, you and I have been friends for a while, but I'm going to write something now that's been on my mind for quite some time and that is: don't get defensive! The previous comments are not directed just at you. No one questions how much work you've put into this site in the past. But really, admit it, we barely hear from any of the admins anymore. Stuff needs to be fixed here once and for all.. Priority 1: get the email system fixed 2. Get the "mark all discussions as read" fixed 3. Get a contest going so that members get excited again, because clearly, the last fiasco left a bad mark on this place and it needs to be rectified now. Those 3 items need to be addressed ASAP, Sean, so please get together with Joe and Christopher and get them to start doing something about it. And if you need help from any members here with the technical ability to assist you, for heavens sake, just ask. All of us know that you guys have work and personal lives and it doesn't hurt to admit that you just have too much on your plate at the moment and that you need help. We, the members, would rather read that then read more empty promises. peace! KarenPosted 3 years ago #
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@Pete: I do understand you and others, along with the frustrations going on with the site. I know you didn't mention prize money but you did mention admins making promises and not following through for the site, which is why I brought up the Kontera money. With that, a contest could be held. I know people are upset about the first contest being messed up with the whole host sponsored contest with rules for it being ok for them to pull out. Why I mentioned the Kontera money is I can make a promise and say we can have a contest and use that money for a prize. That would show come creditability for at least one admin saying something and following through. As for your comment "I think you see this site as your site rather than the community's" is just crazy. For one, if it was my site, a lot of these technical issues wouldn't be happening. When I hosted the OD site in the beginning, we could make changes, fix things, including server issues within seconds. Now, with the donated hosting from OpenReactions, it's up and down. Sometimes we can't log into SFTP or the database, sometimes the site runs slow, trying to move files over when SFTP or a database server isn't playing nice doesn't help and causes more issues with not all files or data moving over. I do not own this site. I do not own the domain name. Never have and never will. Most of the issues and feature requests are easy but with the above issues, it is hard to fix. I know Joe has been looking into this. He has control of the domain name and the hosting for OD. Christopher and I do not. I personally want Joe to chime in on this. I've emailed him. Got one small reply and now waiting for another. Bottom line without going on and on in this reply. I feel everyone's pain with all of this. Part of why it's frustrating for me being able to fix things but can't with technical issues. Christopher is an amazing and very helpful admin. Joe is also good when he's around or answers emails. When all of this gets fixed, I am going to step down as admin no questions asked. The idea of OD was a good one, but there are so many factors which have all been brought up over the life of the site that I personally feel it can't ever truly be run as a community owned site. Someone will always need to have control, at least the way things are built and set up now.Posted 3 years ago #
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@Karen: Thanks for your reply. Like I just mentioned to Pete, I understand and I am trying not to be so defensive. I care about the site, the members, users and reputation of everything. Speaking of which, Pete, that's why I brought up my history with the other two sites. Both places I took a lot of heat for things that I had no control over but stuck it out for the better of the community and trying to have some positive effect on things, which I really believe I did. Karen, question 1, the email issue is something server code and software related. As mentioned in my reply to Pete, it's an easy fix but with limited un stable access to the server, I can't just fix it. Question 2, I believe it was Bob or someone else who provided a fix for that and it's the same thing as #1, it requires access to the server, so if Joe or Christopher can get in at some random time, they should try and add the fix in too. Question 3, agreed. As I said, I've got the Kontera money ready to go for a prize or a bunch of smaller $25-$30 USD each prizes. I don't have access to the Google Adsense money, Joe does and I know it's a nice chunk. For me, it's not about too much on my plate... it's about certain access to the web server. I have user names and passwords but 9 times of out 10 it doesn't let me log in and I just give up at that moment and try again later.Posted 3 years ago #
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@Pete: just to follow up one more time, my last few comments around the site are exactly what you asked... for an admin to speak up and let people know what's going on. Hopefully though all the yadda yadda you were able to read between the lines and see that. Peace, love and bakies to all :bakie:Posted 3 years ago #
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:o this place is turning into a soap opera. not that I watch those >_> Out of curiosity, if the issue is the server, why are we still using the host? I was gone for a few months, so I'm completely out of the loop on most of the stuff in this topic. And Sean, I don't think anyone doubts your loyalty to the community. You're a great guy and the fact that you're still here is proof enough of your loyalty.Posted 3 years ago #
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@JeremyD: Joe was in talks with a few different hosts, so he will need to get that resolved. He also has control of the domain name, so if/when OD gets a new host, he would need to make the DNS name server changes. Thank you for your continued support as well.Posted 3 years ago #
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No one questions your efforts and time Sean. But I do question the vote for the kontera ads as it was all based on a non-functioning e-mail system for the tally of the votes. They are annoying (yes I blocked but what about others) and if they are not supporting new contest they are just useless and an eyesore *forgive my ranting :cry:Posted 3 years ago #
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Kontera ads will be going away. Google ads are generating a lot more, so soon as I can get proper access to the server, I'll zap the Kontera ads.Posted 3 years ago #
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well, Sean, this is exactly want I didn't want: you getting so upset that you're stepping down! Geez! :cry:Posted 3 years ago #
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@Karen: This current issue isn't why I will be stepping down and I'm really not that upset. I've been through all the ups and downs now with 3 design sites over a 6-7 year period. It takes a lot of of a person and I'm wanting to do other things and put my energies elsewhere... Don't think because soon I won't be an admin anymore I won't be around the site or helping people, etc... I'll still be around... just maybe taking on a different roll as just a user and member... and let others help with putting out fires and the such. As of now I am still an admin and I won't step down until we do get a few things sorted... so rest assured I'm still here, active and doing what I can to help with OD and the Open Source community.Posted 3 years ago #
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Posted By: Seanbut there are so many factors which have all been brought up over the life of the site that I personally feel it can't ever truly be run as a community owned site. Someone will always need to have control, at least the way things are built and set up now.
your absolutely correct sean. thats why in the beginning a few members suggested the site should have been set up through a non-profit somehow. it could have be done but a couple of people didn't want to look into that option or bother waiting for someone else to look into it so the site went ahead anyways and look where it got us. the power structure needs to be spread out more so things can get accomplished. as well if the friggin back end / wordpress / vannilla is hacked that much that we can't give access to mods well i think we need a new backend solution that can will be more general programmer / mod friendly - its that simple. i appreciate the work done on it but its not practical if it cant be shared. if the hosting is not reliable enough for the admins to log into ftp or whatever to fix a few simple things maybe we need to look at another solution - is enough money being brought in by google ads to support $40-60 / month for a VPS? has any asked open reaction about the problems?Posted 3 years ago # -
Yugnats: email joe about hosting if you want to get involved, and I also think that moderators should have more power (aproving designs, posting news, while admins have more power to do things on their own). mark all posts read: That pluggin is nearly devoid of comments, making it imposssible to identify the error. Bob posted a link to a new version coded by someone else, which provides the same functionality. Sean: We'll be sad to see you go.Posted 3 years ago #
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@yugnats: things are not as bad as you make it seem by saying "look where it got us" but even with a non profit sort of set up, there is a huge demographic of people here on OD, so things like which city, state, country, etc would need to be figured out as a home base for OD for a non profit or a corporation set up for the site. If/ when members/ board members, secretaries, etc change, they might want to restructure the whole non profit and/ or corporation... that alone could make things a total nightmare. I don't have any suggestions at this exact moment, but these are a few thoughts and things to consider if/ when things change around OD. I see no issue with changing moderators or admins on a semi regular basis, but for the main body of the site, I think there will always need to be one or two master key holders so to speak, and right now that looks like Joe since he's got the keys to the domain name. Thoughts?Posted 3 years ago #
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Posted By: Sean@yugnats: things are not as bad as you make it seem
- the OR contest was a mess and still hasn't been made right - the back-end (mail, read comments, etc) is still broken - members are sometimes ignored in the forum by admins for days sometimes weeks - the mods or greater community have no control over the site or the domain name - no financial records have been made available and these are just off the top of my head...Posted By: Seaneven with a non profit sort of set up, there is a huge demographic of people here on OD, so things like which city, state, country, etc would need to be figured out as a home base for OD for a non profit or a corporation set up for the site.
this was all discussed before but a few didn't want to wait. besides, what does it matter what city, etc. the point is getting control away from one single person and as far as i can see joe has total control here. i'm not saying he's going to but whats to stop him from selling the site? then we'd be right back where we started...yet again (third times a charm though, lol)!Posted 3 years ago # -
I agree that it would be nearly impossible to set up a legitimate non-profit organization, and probably not worth the hassle. However, I also agree that there is no reason that we can't act like one. All that is required is a contract between the current admin and one that takes their place (I like the idea of changing them out frequently as it will allow an admin with different goals to focus on one aspect of the site). The contract would state that the new admin would act in a manner that is wholly loyal to the community. This allows the current admins to control the website, without giving them free reign. I don't even mind if someone held on to an owner title and took some of the revenues to cover expenses of the domain etc.Posted 3 years ago #
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@yugnats: Here is the Google Adsense break down to date/ the most up to date records. I will also do a screen capture and also a CVS file export but for now here are the raw monies earned with Adsense: May 2007-December 2007 total earned: $642.28 USD from December 2007 to January 23, 2008: $125.23 USD from January to February 22, 2008: $206.26 USD from February to March 25, 2008: $154.90 USD To date, $1,128.67 USD has been earned with Google Adsense. I also started a new thread here on the Google Adsense revenue.Posted 3 years ago #
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Posted By: Mike Weiss... there is no reason that we can't act like one.
Exactly... this is old ground. Have a look at this discussion not too long ago (towards the end) There can be no reason why we at least can act like one even if we can't actually be 'one'. Openness and transparency is very important - but without making it vunerable. Admins need to be elected. By some meaningful means? Money needs to be regularly shown to all Mods/committee members at least and to all members 6 monthly. the owner of the domain name is really the only issue... the templates are freely available (but would be good if a backup of all of them could be available to all mods/admins should we need to start up again) so that's not a real bother. Why don't we elect a member/s to take control of the domain name. they must have to satisfy certain criteria to make sure we don't hand it over to a web dork wannabe like me but rather someone or more who know what it involved and has the appropriate stability and accountability etc. PetePosted 3 years ago # -
okay...now let's get back to the original topic: contests Let's have one soon! I like the themes idea..and the theme I'd like to see is travel destinations what does everyone think?Posted 3 years ago #
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On the topic of the website, it still freezes in IE 6.Posted 3 years ago #
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Posted By: arwen54what does everyone think?
I don't like it. Not very usable except for blogging backpackers? I'd still like to see a business/non-profit organisation themePosted 3 years ago # -
I'd like to see some design ideas that are not the typical blog looking 2 column designs or based off K2.Posted 3 years ago #
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1. Old Age Home (Charity) 2. News Paper (Not Blog) 3. Mac Showroom website:bakie: 4. Grocery Shop 6. Vineyard Website :bigsmile:Posted 3 years ago #
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Posted By: SeanI'd like to see some design ideas that are not the typical blog looking 2 column designs or based off K2.
Me too... having said that lets just pick one, sort out the 'rules' and get the comp going! :)Posted 3 years ago #
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