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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007 edited by Sean on the 01st February 2007 at 15:23:25 EST
I found something disturbing today..I have an incoming WordPress link from a porn site...they are using my Christmas 1 WP theme
here
what can I do about it? I'm really quite upset about this because they left my link on the template which normally I appreciate but NOT in this case. -
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CommentAuthorwebmasterneo
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007 edited by webmasterneo on the 31st January 2007 at 07:29:33 EST
just what happened to me before (discussed at the forum over at owd).
what i did was to email the webmaster/siteowner requesting him to remove the link to my site. he did.
maybe you could do the same. -
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CommentAuthorjanpd24
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
Ow...I can understand your being upset. Any option of contacting them and asking them to remove the link? (Sorry to state the obvious... )
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
that's what I will do...I feel dirty, somehow...what a creep!
thanks! -
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CommentAuthorSean
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007 edited by Sean on the 31st January 2007 at 07:49:24 EST
@arwen54: I know this bothers you but having the design available for download with a creative commons license, anyone can use your designs, even if it's an adult web site as long as they give credit, which they did do.
You say "what a creep" but at the same time, this person found your design and liked it and is using it for a site... isn't that what everyone wants? Their designs being used?
I'm not trying to be a jerk but once a design leaves your hands, especially for being a free download, how can you or anyone for that matter get upset how your design is being used?
I do suggest like mentioned above contacting the site owner and ask them to remove the link if you don't want it there but they did follow your license. -
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
Sean, I know that but it is disturbing to me as a mother to have some creep using my template for a porn site (and yes, I love it when my designs are being used normally)
Anyway, I went to the site...there's no way to contact the person...so I did a whois and found a contact name. I did email a request to remove my link. Hopefully he will comply. That's about all I can do. -
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CommentAuthorSean
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007 edited by Sean on the 31st January 2007 at 08:02:06 EST
Yep arwen54, that's about all you can do.
Maybe you could put something into your design or license saying they can't be used for adult sites but again, based on the CC license, I don't think you can.
Maybe it's time to check with a real legal person who knows internet law, etc and ask some questions?
I'm sure this will happen again or maybe already has to other designers?
Granted, you don't approve of adult content websites but I can tell you that they're not going away because they do make money for people.
Looking at the site using your design, it just seems like a new site with no content, so maybe they will end up removing your name and the design down the road.
Good luck and let us know if you get a reply from the person. -
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
unfortunately porn sites aren't going away...I wish they would...that is the dark side of the web...I was contacted twice to design sites with objectionable
content..once for a porn site and once for a satanic site...I turned down both projects...to me money isn't everything...and believe me, I could have used that money back then... -
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
oh and thanks, again, everyone, for your support. -
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CommentAuthorbakercad
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
Just an idea here, but can a "clause" be added in the license that the template cannot be used for pornographic, satanic, or other questionable material?
Or request that if they contain this material that the link back my be removed? -
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CommentAuthorSean
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
@bakercad: that was my suggestion but before we/OD makes any changes to licenses, it should be run by someone who is an attorney who is well versed in internet law and the full Creative Commons license.
If we add something in like that without checking first, we could be opening a can of worms which we don't want.
As for what's questionable material, that's in the eye of the beholder, so that's a hard one to justify, especially when using CC or public domain licensing. -
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CommentAuthorChristopher
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
I've had adult orientated sites use a design of mine in the best, but hey the design was created to be used and to be quite honest it doesn't bother me personally in the slightest on what sites it's used.
Hope the person does as you ask though Karen
Regarding questions about can a clause be added to a Creative Commons licensed template the answer is yes (I think, my reasons as to why follow, but if you know otherwise please feel free to have some input!).
The Creative Commons License under it's most basic representation about attribution is (taken from the prior link) this:
Attribution. You must attribute the work in the manner specified by the author or licensor.
So you could put in the template that it is CC2.5 licensed and to use it they must attribute you, unless they are person 1 or 2. Where person 1 and 2 could be "adult orientated sites" and "hate sites, or those which imply hatred on another person / object" etc. (as a stupid example
couldn't think how to word that one right hehe)
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CommentAuthorbakercad
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
heh....guess I should have read your post a bit more.
Shouldn't be a legal issue if you "request" that they remove the link back. Doesn't mean that the legally HAVE to, just means that you've politely asked them to.
Here's a little reading for you:CC FAQ's - I don’t like the way a person has used my work... -
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CommentAuthorSean
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
Taken from bakercad's link:If you do not like the way that a person has made a derivative work or incorporated your work into a collective work, under the Creative Commons licenses, you may request removal of your name from the derivative work or the collective work.
In addition, the copyright laws in most jurisdictions around the world (with the notable exception of the US) grant creators “moral rights†which may provide you with some redress if a derivative work represents a “derogatory treatment†of your work. Moral rights give an original author the right to object to “derogatory treatment†of their work; “derogatory treatment†is typically defined as “distortion or mutilation†of the work or treatment, which is “prejudicial to the honor, or reputation of the author.†All Creative Commons licenses (with the exception of Canada) leave moral rights unaffected. This means that an original author may be able to take action against a derivative work that infringes the moral right that protects against derogatory treatment. Of course, not all derivative works that a creator does not like will be considered “derogatory.â€Â
So you can ask them to remove it. -
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007 edited by Sean on the 27th June 2008 at 01:34:27 EDT
ah that's good info...anyway...I think what I'll do is put a readme file in my template packages and include something like this: you are free to use my templates or WordPress themes for whatever purpose and I appreciate all users who choose to link with me, however, if you promote x, y, and z, I would appreciate it if you please remove my link from the footer. Thank you for your consideration.
Karen Blundell..etc...
what do you think? will that help or am I just wasting my time and perhaps making too much of this?
@sean: good there it is...clear as day...now we all know...
@Christopher: as a parent of a 15-year-old son, I can't have my name linked to any site like that, you know? I know there are many people who aren't bothered by this stuff...mostmothersparents would be, I think -
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CommentAuthorbakercad
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007 edited by bakercad on the 31st January 2007 at 09:34:39 EST
I doubt that every porn web will read it, but if they do, it may help a bit.
You may want make the readme file name "LicenseConditions" or something like that. If you happen upon a site that you find objectionable and they've left the link, point them to the "LicenseConditions" file and ask them to remove the link.
My $0.02 USD -
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
thanks, Bob
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- CommentAuthorainslie
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
The first time you see the incoming referrers from the porn sites it feels a little sickening. My WordPress themes, Chameleon and WP-Andreas09 (Andreas Viklund Design) both seem to have been popular on these sort of sites.
It's a shock, but I see it as a hazard of the job. Just ask them to remove the link. I'm sure they will in most cases, as it hardly make much difference to them.
Surprisingly, they are only human beings behind these sites! -
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CommentAuthorwebmasterneo
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
the readme could help, but as bakercad said, it is doubtful that they read them at all.
learning from previous similar experiences, what i did for my last two submissions was to explicitly request on the template page itself that the templates not be used for adult or related sites. i just don't know if they would ever be read.
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
well, surprise, surprise...no repsonse to the email I sent to the person
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CommentAuthorjelontok
- CommentTimeJan 31st 2007
@arwen: i have a similar experience.. i think it was an amateur web cam site and a site named paris hilton tonight.com
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CommentAuthorgnome
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
Arwen: you can always go to their Host/ISP, and say that you don't approve of that kind of content in your template, and that you would like to be put in contact with the admin there. It would be a long shot, but the host is guaranteed to have some means to contact them. -
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CommentAuthorbakercad
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
in addition to the readme.....place the "remove my link, pornboy!" in the html file so it's visible when they preview the template.
OR....I know that the "chain gang" (as I like to call them...Joe, Sean and Christopher) is quite busy, but maybe give an option for designers to check a box saying "not for porn...etc" when a design is submitted. Then when the design is downloaded there is a message saying "The designer of this template has requested that this template NOT be used for porn, Paris Hilton and other things that start with the letter "P". If you insist on using it for this purpose, please remove the link to this designer's site." then make them click a button before the download continues.
Just an idea guys....don't kill me. Offers a bakie..
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
good suggestions, everyone...thank you
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CommentAuthorSean
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
Chain gang? Wasn't that a porn film?
In all seriousness, even if we put an option to say that a template can not be used for porn doesn't mean the user/downloader won't do it any way and actually that kills the idea behind this site, providing templates to help make the internet a prettier place.
If we start saying "a template can be used for this or that but not this", there goes the open source spirit... and you should just stop providing templates right now.
However I do think that the designer should put something in the design readme file or try and contact the person using the design and ask that the designer link be removed if the design is going to be used on an adult themed website.
That's going to be the best thing. -
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CommentAuthorbakercad
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007 edited by bakercad on the 01st February 2007 at 09:01:11 EST
Not a big fan of porn, so not too sure about the "Chain Gang" title. Sounds like it could be though.
i'm not saying "a template can be used for this or that but not this"....i just mean to have a notice stating that the "The designer of this template has requested that this template NOT be used for this or that but not this". A request...not a poke in the eye to the open source community. Maybe instead have something like this:
"The designer of this template has requested thatthis template NOT beif this template is used for porn, Paris Hilton and other things that start with the letter "P". If you insist on using it for this purpose, that you please remove the link to this designer's site." -
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CommentAuthorChristopher
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
There is only one way that you can make sure the design isn't used on an adult content orientated site, and that is to not create the design in the first place.
Having restriction options in the submission process on what type of sites a design can and cannot be used on just seems really picky to me. If you have specific requests about the way in which a design is used then insert them into a readme file or similar of the .zip and then hope people follow them. Just because you tick a box saying this and that doesn't mean it has any effect. As an example you choose creative commons and request a linkback, that does not mean 100% of all sites that use the design will follow that procedure. There is no way to guarantee that checking a box saying that the design cannot be used on adult orientated sites will have any effect, if anything, it will just cause even more problems.
Example, Bob chooses the option that says his design cannot be used on adult sites, but then Mr XXX uses Bob's design on an adult site, now does Bob go after Mr XXX, or, does Bob come and moan at Open Designs because he checked that option which says it cannot be used for that purpose. Because Bob checked that option, he might think the error is with Open Design for not making sure the guidelines were followe,d as he submitted under the condition of that little box he checked.
Does that make sense? I hope it does :) -
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CommentAuthorSean
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
I agree 100% with you Christopher and that's basically what I was trying to say above. -
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CommentAuthorChristopher
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
Oh my *needs to wake up a bit more* what I wrote is pretty much excatly what you said above. Just ignore me from here on in
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CommentAuthorbakercad
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007 edited by bakercad on the 01st February 2007 at 10:14:31 EST
i understand exactly what you're saying. I'm not saying that we have restrictions. I'm saying to show a notice to the person downloading the file. The idea of having the notice to the downloader IS NOT a 100% guarantee that they'll remove the link. The idea behind it is to make it a little more likely that they will see the request of removing the designer's link. It is in addition to the readme file. I'm in no way saying that this is the perfect solution....just another means of getting the message read and helping the designer's wishes be met.
As for "Bob" thinking the error is with Open Designs, there could be some text next to the checkbox stating that Open Designs can't be held responsible for the use of the template.
Anyhow...I'm done. I'm doubting that this will be considered, but I shared my idea. -
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- CommentAuthorDeanStev
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
you do know that you are helping their google ranking by linking to it at the top? -
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CommentAuthorSean
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
I added the nofollow tag to the link, so at least it won't get indexed on Google. -
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- CommentAuthorAndreas
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
Porn sites are not a big problem, they are mostly harmless. Ultra-political sites and regular spam sites are much worse, as they can send a lot of angry visitors to the original designers page.
I read an interesting post about this on another theme designers site today, where a top US politician had used his design for a blog-based site - and his political opponents were trying to storm the designers mailbox with stupid comments. While most people understand the difference between "site owner" and "template designer", not everyone does. Most designers will meet this problem at some point...
I see negative results of these misunderstandings in my mailbox every day. But like Ainslie said, it comes with the job. In most cases, a friendly e-mail pointing to a published explanation (like the one on my contact page - http://andreasviklund.com/contact/) solves the problem. I never contact webmasters about removing the link, but it would of course be a good suggestion if you are worried about being connected to websites that you don't like.
Personally, I think that if I've put it there in the first place and the site owner decides to keep the link, I'll have to accept that people may misunderstand it. It is still only a few e-mails per day to deal with, and the positive effects of the link easily makes it worth that effort. -
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CommentAuthorarwen54
- CommentTimeFeb 1st 2007
I opened up a can of worms here, I see...
well 2 emails later...to the domain owner and host and still no response...
I think I'll just let this die out on it's own...like I should have to begin with...sorry, people
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